The Complementariness of Opposites

Question 1:

TRANSFORMATION of the mind is a positive effort. Suppression of the mind is negative. The difference is that when you are suppressing your mind, you are positively concerned with being against something. When you are transforming your mind, you are not directly concerned with being against something. You are positively concerned for something: the effort is for something, not against something.

For example, if you are fighting directly with sex, then it will be suppression. But if your positive effort is for transformation of sex energy, your positive effort is for something else, then it will not be suppression. Suppression means you have blocked the natural door for the energy, you have blocked the natural outflow, and you have not opened anything else. It is just a blockage. You are against anger, so you block anger - but where will the energy go? The energy that you have suppressed will create inner complexities. It will even be more perverted. So to be natural is better than to be perverted. Perversion is disease; to be natural is healthy.

Of course, just to be healthy is not the end. One can go even beyond health. So these are three things - suppression, being natural and transcendence. Just being natural is just being healthy. If you suppress and there is no positive outlet, no creative outlet for your suppressed energy, then you will become perverted. You are not healthy: you become diseased, you become a "dis-ease".

Don't be concerned negatively. Change the energy, the door, the path, the outlet, positively, and when there is a creative change, the energy that was flowing into sex will not flow. Whenever you can open a higher passage for it, it will flow through it. Whenever you can create something which is better than nature itself, then there is no suppression. This difference must be understood.

Only man can fall below nature; no animal can fall below nature. There are no abnormal animals.

Sometimes animals also become abnormal, but only when they are with men - never alone. A dog can go abnormal, a horse can go abnormal, but never alone, never in their natural state. They can go abnormal with man, with man's society. They can go abnormal in a zoo.

Man can fall down below nature. This may seem unfortunate. This is not because this capacity comes with another capacity: man can transcend nature. No animal can transcend nature. The higher you can go than nature, the lower you can go also, in the same proportion. Every possibility is a double possibility. Every possibility opens two doors that are diametrically opposite. Unless you can fall below nature, you cannot transcend above it. And if you have the capacity to transcend nature, you will have the capacity to fall below it also.

Animals are just natural; they are neither perverted nor are they transformed. Never do they become sub-animal and never do they become super-animal. They are just animal. Man is a flexible potentiality. He can fall below nature, can be perverted, can become mad. He can transcend nature, can become superhuman, can become a Buddha.

Another thing: animals are born with their nature. In a way they are born perfect. An animal is born developed. Man is born without any nature and is not developed at the time of birth. He develops later. Then many possibilities open, and there is a great range of possibilities. Marl is born undeveloped - not only mentally, but even bodily he is born undeveloped. No animal child is born with an undeveloped body; the body is complete. That's why, when the animal child is born, he is capable of living even without parents.

Man's child is born undeveloped, and even in the physiological structure many things develop only after he is born - and it takes years. In the mother's womb he is not completely developed, and because of that, the phenomenon of mother is born - because mothering continues. If the child is born completely developed, then there will be no mothering. The whole institution of the family developed - and, consequently, the whole society - the whole society was born because the child is born undeveloped. He has to be looked after, taken care of. Only after twenty years will he really be out of the womb. In these twenty years, he will need a family, loving care, a society, in which to develop This will be a greater womb.

Even when he is physically complete, mentally he is not. He will have to develop his mind. And, really, the average mind is never beyond fourteen years of age. The average mind remains below thirteen and a half. The average mental age is thirteen and a half. A person who is physically seventy is mentally thirteen and a half. The mind remains in such a primitive, primary state! Body becomes complete, mind remains incomplete, and spirit is not even touched. Man dies without ever having evolved any spirit.

Whenever someone asked Gurdjieff, "Have we souls?" he would say, "No! Sometimes it happens that a man has a soul. Sometimes only does it happen." Gurdjieff would say, "only sometimes, rarely does it happen that a man has a soul. You are not even complete minds, so how can you have a soul?" An incomplete body cannot have a mind, an incomplete mind cannot have a soul, and an incomplete soul cannot realize the Divine. Really, body works as a womb for the mind, and mind works as a womb for the spirit, then spirit works as a womb for God. So man is not born fixed, complete. He is born only as a multi-potentiality, and he can fall down - below nature. He can be more animalistic than any animal and he can be a superhuman being also, he can be just Divine. This range of possibilities is there.

Now you can do two things. If your mind becomes negative, suppressive, you go on fighting things which are not "good". So you fight sex, you fight anger, you fight greed, you fight jealousy, you fight violence - you go on fighting. But when a person is fighting violence he will never be non-violent, because to fight violence one needs to be violent.

You cannot fight violence without being violent, so your so-called non violent saints are all violent - deeply violent. Of course, their violence is not against others: their violence is against themselves.

So no one objects; you can even applaud them. They are against themselves - very violent! You cannot fight violence. How can you fight violence without being violent? How can you fight anger without being angry? The very attitude to fight anger is a subtle anger. The very fight means you are angry. You are not at ease with your anger.

You can take a negative attitude, and you can go on fighting with things which are there. The more you fight them, the more you become like them. A person fighting sex will become sexual. His every gesture will become sexual. His sitting, his standing, his walking, will become sexual. He will be so much obsessed with fighting it that everything will take the tinge and colour of sex.

When you fight with something, you have to use the techniques of your enemy. If you want to win, you have to use the same techniques that your enemy is using. So even if you win in the end, you will not win because the techniques will be the same. Really, you will have been defeated. Fight with anger, and if you are defeated then anger will be there. If you win, then also there will be anger.

Only anger will have won against anger.

This negative fight will narrow down your consciousness more and more, and you will become afraid of everything. A negative mind is always in fear. Everything becomes a sin and everything creates guilt and everything creates fear. You are just in a deep escape from everything. Your consciousness will be narrowed down; it will not expand. You will become so much afraid that you will just hide within yourself, and everywhere around will be all the enemies. You have created them because you became negative.

This is suppression, and you will end in a madhouse. Everything that you have suppressed you will have to suppress continuously. The fight will be so continuous that you will not be able to do anything else. If you are fighting sex, then it will be enough - your whole life will be just a fight. If you are fighting greed, then it will be enough; even greed itself will not take so much energy as the fight with greed. Sex will not take so much energy, it will not dissipate so much energy, as fighting with sex - because sex is just natural, and the fight creates negativity: whenever you are negative, you only dissipate energy. Nothing is gained, nothing creative is achieved. You become self-destructive.

So always remember never to be negative; then there will be no suppression. But I have told you that to go against the current is the way for the mind to flow upward. What do I mean by going against the current? The difference is very subtle, but once felt, you can never lose the track.

For example, you are swimming in a river against the current. Two are the possibilities: one, you are just fighting the river, just fearful of being taken away by the river - taken down, taken in the flow - just afraid, trembling, fighting against the river. Then you will be defeated because this very attitude of fear of being taken away, of this trembling mind, cannot win. The defeat has set in How long will you be able to fight the current? The whole attitude is negative, and the river is very much positive, lifelike. But you are just fear and trembling. How can you win? Sooner or later you will dissipate energy in the fight, and the current will take you away.

There is a second point, another dimension: you are not fighting the river because you are not fearful of it. The first thing: fight is created because of fear. Remember, fight means fear. Fear comes first, then you begin to fight Your fear creates fight, your fear creates the foe. So basically, fear is at the root. You are not fighting the river because you are not fearful of the river. You are not fearful of the river because you know that this is just natural that The river flows downward. Even if you flow downward, there is no guilt. It is natural. Even if you flow downward, it is not a defeat. It is a defeat only if you fight - then it becomes defeat. It is just natural: the river flows downward and you flow with it. You can even enjoy it. You can feel the bliss of the flowing river - without any effort, just moving with the current, and the current takes you away. You can even conserve energy by flowing down naturally.

So the first thing: don't be fearful of a downward flow don't be fearful! Remember, it is natural, and it is better to flow with the current than to be defeated and taken away - because then the whole thing will lose the bliss that is possible naturally. So the first thing: to be natural is not a sin. Remember, because only then can whole effort become positive; otherwise, it will be negative.

To be natural is not a sin. Of course, it is not enough - mm? - that is another thing. But it is not a sin. If you are flowing naturally, that is okay. As far as it goes, it is okay. It is not a sin, it is not a guilt, it is not immoral - it is just healthy. But I say it is not enough. It is not enough because your possibilities are still more. They are not just to be healthy. You can be holy also.

So don't be in fear - first thing. Don't be in condemnation of nature, and then the negative attitude will not be there.

Now: don't fight the current - play with the current. You are not fighting the river really, you are just training yourself to go upward. Feel the difference: you are not fighting the river - you are just filled with an abundance, you are just filled with energy and training the energy to go upward. Now the river is not an enemy. Rather, it is a friend, because it gives you the opportunity to go up, to play with it. Now the fight is not a fight at all. It is a game, it is a play. And the river is not your enemy, it is a situation. Life is a situation, it is not an enemy. Nature is a situation, it is not an enemy - it is an opportunity.

So try to train your inner energy to flow upward. You are not really concerned with the river going downward. You are concerned with a different river of energy going upward. Your mind is basically concerned with the inner energy which can go upward.

Feel thankful for the river - because it gives you a background, it gives you an opportunity, it helps you, it cooperates with you. You can weigh yourself only through its current. You can feel yourself only because the river is going downward. The feeling that you can go upward even when the river is flowing down gives you a very different quality of confidence - you can go upward. And now, even if you relax and flow with the river, you know very well that you can go upward. Now even this downward flow with the river is not a defeat. You have known something - something different from nature.

If you have glimpsed something different from nature even for a single moment, then you have known your potentiality. You may achieve it, you may not achieve it, but now you are not just part of the downward flow - the upward flow is possible. Now it will depend on you. You will be the decisive factor, not the downward current. Now there is no enmity! If the river flows downward, it is okay. You need not flow, you need not fight, you need not be in fear. You can go up.

Ultimately, there is another possibility in which tantra has gone very deep. Tantra says there is a possibility when you flow downward with the river and still you flow upward. Then only your body is carried away. How can the river carry you away? It can carry only the body. Tantra tried to create many downward rivers. So go into the river, feel the downward flow, flow with it, and remember constantly that you are not flowing.

I was saying that by fighting with sex you may be obsessed with sex totally. There is another possibility: even going deeply in sex, you may not be sexual at all. But that possibility opens only when your effort becomes positive. This is what I mean by positive effort against the current. It is not really against the current; it is for the consciousness. The current is being used just as an opportunity - just to weigh yourself, just to find yourself out - just to feel the upward, the downward is needed. The more forceful the current, the more forceful will be the feeling of the upward. So use nature as an opportunity, not as an enemy. Use instincts as friends, not as enemies They are friends. Only through your ignorance can you make them enemies. They are friends!

And when someone reaches the original source, the peak of the river from where the river comes down, one is just thankful - thankful towards the river, grateful towards the river, because it is only through the river that he could achieve the source. So when someone reaches the peak of consciousness, one is thankful to every instinct - because they all helped, they all created the situation, they all created the opportunity. And they were flowing in the opposite direction. So their opposite flow is not really against you; the river is not against you. You can be against the river, and if you are against the river then you will never win. The greater possibility is that you may become perverted.

So use nature to transcend it. When you see there is anger, don't fight anger directly. Weigh yourself, feel the energy, transcend the anger. Anger is there: remain silent, feel anger and feel yourself and weigh yourself - begin to flow upward. Take it as a play. Don't be serious! Seriousness is a disease.

If you take everything negatively, then you will be serious. Then everything disturbs you: "Why is there anger? Why is there greed? Why this? Why that?" Everything disturbs you and you become serious.

But our so-called saints are very serious. Really, I cannot conceive how a saint can be serious. He can only be playful. The seriousness shows he has been fighting. A soldier, of course, is bound to be serious. A saint need not be, must not be. Really, it disqualifies him from being a saint. A saint must be playful because nothing is against him - everything is for him. He can use everything for himself.

When I say "effort against the current", I mean play against the current - play! Try! See what you can do. The current is flowing downward. Can you flow upward? The anger is there. someone has insulted you, the button has been pushed. Can you remain non-angry? Just play - play with the situation; don't be serious. The moment you become serious, you become angry, really. Anger is very serious. Be playful, laugh, and see that the anger has been put on, that the conditioned mind has been put on. The anger is boiling there. Now, swim against the current. Take it as a play, and see whether it is possible that someone has insulted you. the anger has been created in the metabolism. Can you still swim beyond it? Don't fight it!

That's why I say the difference is very subtle. Standing on the bank you cannot feel the difference - unless you have been in the river and experienced both. You are standing on the bank, and someone is fighting the river and someone is just playing with the river, going upward. What difference can you see from the bank? Only one: one will be serious and the other will be playful - nothing else.

One who is in fear, afraid, fighting, will be serious - dead serious. How can he laugh? How can he play? If the current pushes him, he will feel defeated. The other one who is playing will not be serious at all. He can laugh: he can laugh with the river, he can laugh with the waves. And if the current pushes him down he will not feel defeated - he will try again. He will not be serious. Rather, he will begin to love the river because it pushes. He will begin to love the river! The difference will be inner, qualitative.

Suppression is a serious disease. Transforming oneself is a play - it is not serious at all. It is sincere. but never serious. It is authentic, but never serious. The quality of playfulness always remains there. It is the very spirit. With positivity you are creating something inside. The outward is just an opportunity; the inside creation is the thing. The emphasis is on something else. It is not on fighting the river: the emphasis is on the upward flow.

For example, I am writing something on a blackboard. I use a blackboard but I write with white chalk, because on a blackboard the white chalk becomes clear in contrast. I can write on a white wall also.

The writing will be there, but it will be as if it is not because the contrast will not be there. So the blackboard is not against the white chalk. It is not the enemy: it is the friend. Only when they are against it do the white lines become more white. On a white wall they will just lose themselves, they will be nowhere.

So who is the enemy - the white wall or the blackboard? Who is the enemy? The white wall is the enemy because you lose. The blackboard is not the enemy. Really, it is the friend. On it, the white becomes more white and clear and apparent. But when I am writing on a blackboard my emphasis, my intention is not to destroy the blackboard. Rather, my intention is to make the white lines clear.

If you are trying to destroy the blackboard, then the blackboard is the enemy. See the difference: if you are trying to destroy the blackboard by whitewashing it, then you will feel the blackboard as the enemy.

You can whitewash it; then there will be a fight. But when you are writing something on it, your emphasis is not on the blackboard. Really, you never remember it, you need not remember it. It is not even in your awareness; it is only on the fringe. You write: the emphasis is on writing, not on destroying the blackboard. You remember what you are writing, and the blackboard helps. It never obstructs you.

So your emphasis must be on what you are trying to achieve. not on what you are against. If you are trying to achieve love, then be positively concerned with love, not with destroying hate. You can never destroy it! You will not be able to destroy hate. But the moment love is there, the whole energy is transformed. It begins to flow "lovewards".

Don't be negative about your energies, instincts, about anything. Be positive. And when you are positively creating something, be playful. It is your nature. Why fight it? you have created it. It is your effort. You wanted to create it, so you have created it. You have chosen it; it is your freedom.

If you are angry, it is your choice - so why be against it? It is your choice! For lives and lives you have used anger, so it is there. Why be angry against it? No one has chosen it except you. So whatsoever you are, you are your own creation.

So it is nonsense to think in terms of negativity. Rather, feel that if you can create such a madman inside of you, then, really, you are capable of many things. If you can create such a hell, why not a heaven? But don't be concerned with the hell. Be concerned with heaven and begin to create it.

When the heaven is created you will not find the hell. It will have disappeared completely because it exists only as a negative, it exists only as an absence.

Because there is no heaven, hell has to be. Because there is no love, hate has to be. Because there is no light, darkness is there. Don't fight with darkness: create the light, be concerned with the creation of light. When the light is there, where will the darkness be then? But you can fight directly.

Don't think about the light at all and begin to fight darkness directly. But no matter what you do, the darkness will never be destroyed. On the contrary, you may be destroyed in the fight. How can you fight darkness directly? It is an absence. Darkness only means that the light is not. So, please, create light.

The river is flowing downward, and you are flowing with it because you don't know the upward flow.

You have not known it: that is the only thing. Once you know it, all the rivers may flow downward, but you cannot flow downward. Then go with the river to the very sea, and you will not go downward.

It is difficult to sense the difference. That's why so much suppression is in the world. No one has taught it - everyone has understood it. No one has taught it - neither a Buddha nor a Mahavir nor a Jesus nor a Krishna. This is a miracle. No one has taught suppression because no one can. It is absolute nonsense! But everyone has suppressed and everyone is suppressing - because the difference is so subtle that whenever transformation starts, suppression is understood.

Whenever a teacher is born who begins to talk about transformation, followers gather who begin to understand about suppression - because it is so delicate, so delicate that unless you experience it there is every possibility you will misunderstand it. So try to experience it. The primary requirement:

Don't be against anything - be for! Be for something! Don't be against something!

Really, when you are against something your future is not open. Only when you are for something does your future open. When you are against something you are clinging to the past. You can never be against the future. How can you be against the future? You can only be against the past. So let it be understood in this dimension also: when you are against, you are against the past. You are fighting with death. The past is no more, so why fight it? Create the future; be for something. Then you become positive.

There are two types of freedom: one is from something and one is for something. A young man is fighting with his parents to be free; he goes hippie. Then for some time the fight continues. The parents cannot do anything, and they forget. Then for the first time the boy begins to feel, "What to do?" because he was only against. The freedom was from the parents. It was not leading anywhere; it was not for something. It was just against something.

This not only happens to individuals. It happens to races, to nations. It has happened always. You fight for freedom against the British or against someone else. Ultimately you achieve the freedom, and then you begin to feel vacant, empty. What to do? You were never fighting for something, so your force dies with your enemy.

One young man came to me, very educated. He was madly in love with a girl, but his parents were not for it. They didn't belong to the same religion. He was saying, "Whatsoever the future may be - even if I may be just begging on the street - I am going to marry this girl. But my father is determined to disown me if I marry this girl." His father is a rich man, so I asked the boy, "Are you really in love with the girl or just angry with your father? Decide this - because these are two different things. Are you really in love with this girl or is this love just a by-product and you are really against your father and using this love as a fighting point, as a front?" He hesitated. He said, "Let me think about it. I have not thought it over. But why do you ask such a question? Really, I am in love!" I said, "You just go and think it over." He came and said, "No, I am in love." I just looked into his eyes and he became uneasy. I remained silent and continuously looked in his eyes, stared. He became uneasy and said, "What are you doing? Do you think I am not in love?" I was still silent. He said, "What do you mean? Why are you so silent? Do you think that I am falsifying, or that I am rationalizing?" I remained silent. He said, "It seems you have read my mind. The more I think about it, the more I feel that I am against my father.

But still I am going to marry." So I said, "Okay, marry!" After five years he committed suicide. He wrote a letter to me: "You were right. The moment I married, the whole love died because with marriage the fight with my father ended. I was disowned and there was no relationship. Everything ended, and in that very moment the romance was not there. It was really a fight against something; it was not for something." And he said, "Now I am committing suicide because life is so boring." Life will be a boredom if you are always against and never for. Never be against: be always for. So when I say "against the current". I mean for something, for the peak. Sex is not bad, but the peak is better. So never think in terms of bad and good. Always think in terms of good and better. Mm?

The bad must be thrown out; it must not be given any status in the mind. Always think in terms of good and better and better. Life is that.

Once you create good and bad, soon the good will drop and bad and worse and worse will follow.

So nothing is bad, but better things are possible. Always remember, and struggle for better things.

Then you have a positive flow.

Question 2:

One thing: when you really become free, when you really become free, you cannot even feel freedom. It is always felt against slavery. So when you really become free, you neither feel freedom nor slavery. Then you are free. If you feel freedom, it means still some slavery is there. Freedom is felt only against slavery. When you enter the real freedom, you enter an existence which is lived moment-to-moment, neither as unfree nor as free.

But the very formulation of the question carries our mind with it - the very formulation: "When shall we be free?" We are against something: "When shall we be free?" And especially from sensual things. But why? The old mind, the old preachings, the morality, the religions - they all teach that as long as there is sensuality you will never be free. They say that as long as sensuality is there you can never be free - sensuality must go; then you will be free. That's why we ask.

Really, as far as I am concerned, sensuality will not be there but you will be more sensuous when you are really free. You will be more sensitive, and your every sense will become so cleansed that you cannot even conceive what these senses can give. But there will be no sensuality. Sensuality is something else: it is not sensuousness. Sensuality means a hankering; it means a constant obsession.

For example, one who is constantly thinking about food, he cannot meditate, he cannot pray, he cannot study. Whatsoever he is doing, the food is an obsession inside. He will go on enjoying food in his imagination. Even if he begins to think about heaven, he will think about food: "What type of food will be available in heaven?" So such persons have said that in heaven there is a KALP-VRIKSH - a tree under which you sit and think anything and it is supplied instantaneously, immediately. You think of food and the food is there. You think of a woman and the woman is there. You think of wine and the wine is there. It is a wish-fulfilling tree. Those who imagined this tree must have been very, very deep in sensuality. In the Koran it is said that in heaven there are rivers of wine. So whosoever has thought this must have been deeply sensual - a hankering, such a hankering, that even in Heaven....

When Islam was developing in Arabian countries, homosexuality was just an accepted norm. So only in the Mohammedan heaven is homosexuality allowed - in no other heaven. It is said that not only beautiful girls, but beautiful boys will be available. This is sensuality. You cannot even conceive of heaven without your lusts.

I don't say that there will not be... I am not saying that Maybe! - but why do you think about it? I am not concerned at all with what is there or not, but why can your mind not conceive anything except that which you are after? You have to make provisions and you have to make pre-arrangements, plannings. This is sensuality.

And this is the paradox: the more sensual you are, the less you will be sensuous, sensitive, because sensitivity is always in the present and sensuality is always in the future. So if a person is constantly thinking of food, when the food is given to him he will not be able to feel the bliss. Really, on the contrary, he will be taking food and thinking of other food. A person who is constantly thinking of sex will not be able to go deep into sex. When he is going into sex he will be thinking of other women, or other men, and then there is a vicious circle.

The less he enjoys, the more he goes after thinking, and everything becomes cerebral, mental. He eats with mind, not with the body. His sex becomes cerebral, his everything becomes cerebral. In everything his mind takes over, and mind cannot do anything except thinking. So mind goes on thinking and thinking. And, really, such a guard is created around the mind that he becomes less and less sensitive. The senses lose life, and the mind exploits everything from the senses. usurps everything. And the mind cannot do anything! It can only think - and thinking cannot give you contentment.

So the more you feel discontent, the more you think. Then you are in a vicious circle, and ultimately you become absolutely incapable of feeling anything through the senses. This is sensuality: senses prostituted by the mind; or mind having taken all the senses into itself. This is sensuality.

A really free consciousness will not be sensual but will be sensitive - deeply sensitive and sensuous.

Really, when a Buddha sees a flower, he sees the flower in its totality, in its total beauty, in its total aliveness. The colour, the fragrance, everything, Buddha sees in its totality. He will never think again about this flower - he will never be sensual. He will not hanker again to see it more and more, repeatedly. He will never think again about this flower - not because he is not sensuous, but because he is totally sensuous, and he has lived this experience so deeply that there is no need to repeat.

The need to repeat comes because you cannot live any moment totally - so you eat, and again you have to think to repeat it; you love, and you have to think to repeat it. You are less concerned with living than you are concerned with repetition. This repetitive hankering is sensuality.

A Buddha is not sensual in this sense - he is deeply sensuous. His every sense-door is clear, transparent. He feels everything, he lives every moment totally, he loves every moment totally. And he experiences it so totally that there is no need to repeat, so he never thinks about it. He goes on and on, and every moment is so rich that there is no need to repeat any old moment. There is no need! The need is created because you are incapable of living in moments which are present. You are incapable, so you go on.

If I pass through this city and think, "No - London is better; I must be there," it means only that I am not capable of experiencing this city. That is why the memory comes. Otherwise, if I can live in this city, there is no need. And remember that this type of mind, when it goes to London, will not be able to live there either, because this type of mind cannot live in the moment that is there. This mind will think about Tokyo, about Calcutta, about other places - and we go on missing.

Live! So a totally free mind will not even be aware of freedom - first thing. It will be so free that it cannot be aware of freedom and it will not be aware of any bondage. It will be aware only of a life which is moving - moving moment-to-moment. And this movement is unmotivated - mm? - that is what is meant by freedom. This movement is unmotivated! If you move with a motivation, then you are bound.

If I am saying something with some motivation, then I am not free. The motivation is my bondage.

And if I am just saying it with no motivation - not even this much: that you may understand or may not understand; not even this much: I must make you understand it - then it has a freedom, unmotivated. Then it is a bliss in itself to have talked, to have said, to have expressed. It is enough!

If there is no motivation beyond it, then it is a free movement. So in freedom you will not live through motivation: you will live directly, immediately. That immediate living is freedom. But there is no awareness of it because you cannot feel it. You can feel it only against some bondage.

Sensuality will not be there, but senses will be there - and more acute, more alive. And this is as it should be. A Jesus can love more. Really, only a Jesus can love - unmotivated. His very being is love. Senses are there - really, for the first time, without the disturbance of the mind, they function totally. Eyes see as they should see. They see without any thought, they see without any prejudice.

They see that which is! Nothing is projected. Ears hear that which is said with no distortion, because the mind is not there. Hands touch that which is with no desire, with no lust, with no motivation, with no longing. Hands just touch - then touch becomes pure, total. With no disturbance, they simply touch, then touch goes deep. Then even by a hand the soul is touched; the hand becomes a passage.

Senses are there - more purified, more acute, more authentic - but sensuality is not there, because such a man lives so deeply that he never wants to repeat. And even if something is repeated, he never feels it is repeated - because everything is so new!

The less you live, the more you have to substitute for it by your dreaming mind. The less you live, the more the mind has to substitute for it. The more you live, the less is the need of the mind to substitute. When you live totally, mind is not needed. When you are in love, why should the mind be needed? When you are eating, why should the mind be needed? When you are walking, why should the mind be needed?

You can move without the mind. You can eat without mind coming in, with no thought process.

You can touch someone, you can kiss someone, you can embrace someone, without the thought process coming in. And then you live totally. And any moment that is lived totally, you will never long for it to be repeated, because you long only for something which has remained incomplete.

The mind goes on back again and again to complete it. The mind is a very great perfectionist - everything must be perfect! So if something is left incomplete, the mind goes back again and again.

It is just like when one of your teeth falls out and then you continuously touch the spot with your tongue to feel the absence - the whole day long. You will be bored, but again, unaware, you will touch the absence. You know now that the tooth is not there, but why does this tongue go now constantly to the spot and it has never done so before? When the tooth was there, this tongue never touched it. Why, when the tooth was there, was the tongue not concerned at all with touching it? When the tooth is not there, the tongue goes on, goes on, goes on - it becomes mad. Why?

Because now the tongue feels something incomplete, some gap, and the gap calls again and again.

So with any experience lived totally, you will never go again to feel it in the mind. If you have really loved someone, there will be no memory - memory in the sense that the mind is going constantly to it again and again. If you have not loved, then the absence is felt. You feel guilty and you feel that something has been missed, so it must be substituted - then the mind goes on thinking.

The freer you are, the less is the need to substitute with mental activity. And sensuality is substituting. You understand me? Sensuality is substituting something that you are missing. So when consciousness is really transformed and becomes free, there is no feeling of freedom. When consciousness is transformed and becomes holy, there is no feeling of holiness. So a real saint is one who doesn't know that he is a saint. Only sinners know that they are saints. Only sinners know!

A really good man never knows that he is good; only bad ones know they are good. How can you feel your health? Only an ill person, a diseased person, begins to think about health. When you are healthy, you are just healthy. Really, you never remember that you are healthy. You begin to feel about the body only when you are ill. So if someone goes on talking about health, be confident that he is ill.

It happens that in persons will go on creating many theories about health. Ill persons will constantly talk about health and will become experts. They will become experts! It happens daily that if you are ill and cannot get beyond your illness, sooner or later you are going to be a naturopath. If medicines are not going to help, what to do? Constant thinking and reading about health will make you a naturopath. So naturopathy is good in one way because every patient becomes a doctor. If you are really healthy, then there is no need! And the same applies everywhere. When you are free, you don't feel it; when you are good, you don't feel it; when you are moral you don't feel it.

And, secondly, when you are free you will live moment-to moment totally. In a general way this can be said. We can never be particular because it will depend. It will depend! For example, Mohammed married, and he married nine women. We cannot conceive the same about Mahavir; we cannot conceive the same about Buddha. Buddha was married and he left his home, but Mohammed married nine women. So if you ask a Jain, he cannot say that Mohammed is a Realized soul.

How can he be? And the same is the case with Mohammedans: they cannot conceive how these "escapists", Mahavir and Buddha, were Realized souls - because whenever someone is Realized he is not afraid. He can marry nine women, and this Buddha leaves even one, escapes. Why?

Jains cannot conceive that Krishna was an Enlightened One, because he was just so ordinary, doing such ordinary things! Love is one of the most ordinary things, and he was loving and singing and dancing and fighting and doing everything. So how can he be Enlightened? Jains think that Krishna died and went to the last hell - the seventh hell. According to them, ke is now in the seventh hell.

He was the greatest sinner possible, because he seduced Arjuna for the fight, for the war. They say Arjuna was just on the verge of being a mahatma. He was just trying to escape when this fellow Krishna seduced him and forced him to fight. So in Jains' eyes this man Krishna is the most violent person - and he is suffering in hell.

This happens, this is natural. This is natural because we become obsessed with types. Then we cannot allow another type to have Freedom, Enlightenment. This depends! The type, the individuality, goes to the very end, to the very peak. It becomes purified, but it goes on. So a Buddha may feel that now he need not be attached with any woman. It depends on him. It depends - and he is free to move in his way. And a Mohammed may think quite differently, and he is free to move in his own way. And everyone moves, when free, in his own way. You cannot force a type.

For example, Mohammed was not at ease with music at all. He could not be; that was his type.

But then Mohammedans think that anyone who loves music is just a sinner, so in a Mohammedan mosque you cannot play music. But Mohammed loved perfume very much, so Mohammedans continue to love perfumes. A very poor Mohammedan, particularly on religious days, will also use perfume sometimes. Perfume is as sensuous as music - even more. So what is the difference?

Perfume is music for the nose and nothing else, and music is perfume for the ears and nothing else.

But it depends on the type!

When Mohammed became free, totally free, Enlightened, his "type" began to move freely in his own way, and a sudden burst and a sudden feeling for perfumes came - unmotivated. But when followers come, they create motivations. They begin to think that some reason must be there. Nothing is there as a reason. It is simply the freedom of a type.

Meera goes on singing and Chaitanya goes on dancing from village to village. Mohammed cannot conceive: "What nonsense are you doing? Dancing - how is it related with Divine Realization?" And a Chaitanya cannot conceive how you can remain without dancing when that Friend comes. How can you remain without dancing? A Chaitanya cannot conceive how a Buddha likes sitting when the Divine has come to the door: "How can you go on sitting like that when the Light has descended?

You must go dancing! You must become mad!" But these are types, and one must be aware to allow every type to be there. Then the world is richer.

So I cannot say what will happen to you when you are free - what senses will become more purified, what senses will begin to be expressive of your soul. No one can say; it is unpredictable. One thing is certain: sensuality will not be there. Senses will be there - more perfect, more pure - and purer will be their experience and deeper. The sensitivity will be there, but no sensuality.

Question 3:

No, it is not possible! You cannot practise both simultaneously because both are diametrically opposite. They lead to one point, but they don't pass through the same road, through the same route, through the same realms. They are quite diametrically opposite.

You cannot practise both, just like you cannot go to one place simultaneously following two roads.

Two roads may be going. You are going to the station and two roads may be going to the station, but you cannot follow both the roads simultaneously. And if you do follow them, you will not reach the station. Both roads go, but then you will not reach because then you will have to go ten steps on one, then come back, follow the other, then come back, follow the first one. Then you can follow much, but you will reach nowhere.

Every way is a particular way. It has its own route, its own steps, its own milestones, its own symbols, its own philosophy, its own methodology, its own vehicles, its own mediums of movement. It has its own everything: every way is a perfect way. So never be in two minds. It will simply create confusion.

Follow one! When you reach to the end, you will know that even if you had followed the other you would have reached. When you have reached, you can try just as a play to go on the other - that's another thing - just to know whether this road also comes or not. But don't follow two simultaneously, because every path is so scientifically perfect that this will only create disturbance.

Really, in the old days, even to know about the other path was prohibited because even that knowing creates disturbance. And our minds are so childish and so curious, and foolishly curious, that if we hear about something else or read about something else we begin to amalgamate. And we don't know that anything which is meaningful on a particular path may be just harmful on another. So you cannot amalgamate. Some part in one car may be meaningful, useful - so useful that the car cannot move without it. But the same part can become a hindrance in another car. Don't use it, because every part is meaningful only in its own pattern, in its own gestalt. The moment you change the whole, the part becomes a hindrance.

So much confusion has come into the religious world because now every religion is known to everybody, every path is known, and you are just confused. Now, to find a Christian is difficult, to find a Hindu is difficult, to find a Mohammedan is difficult, because everyone is just something of a Hindu, something of a Mohammedan, something of a Christian - and that creates very much danger. It is dangerous. It may prove suicidal.

So purity of path is a basic necessity for one who has to follow. If one has just to think about it, then there is no need for any purity. You can go on thinking. But if you are to travel, then purity of the path is very essential. And you must be aware not to confuse anything and not to bring any alien, foreign element in it.

It doesn't mean that the other is wrong. It only means that the other is right only on the other's path.

You need not take the other conclusion that "Only I am right and the other is wrong." The other is right in its own way. And if you have to follow another path, just go to the other's way leaving your way completely.

That is why the old religions - and there are only two basic religions: Hindu and Jewish - were never ready to convert anyone. And the only reason was this, that they knew a very old, very deep tradition - that to convert is to confuse. If someone has been brought up as a Christian and you convert him into a Hindu you will just confuse him because now he cannot forget that which he has known. Now you cannot just wash it out. It will remain there, and on that foundation, whatsoever you give him as Hinduism will not mean the same because his old foundation will always be there.

You will just confuse him, and that confusion will not make him religious, cannot make him.

So the old religions - really, there are just two old religions, the Jewish and the Hindu, and all other religions are just branches of those - have remained very dogmatically non-converting. The Hindu concept was disturbed by Dayananda. Because his mind was working in a political way, not in a religious one, he began to convert. But that concept has a beauty of its own. It doesn't mean that other religions are bad; it doesn't mean that others are not right. It doesn't mean anything like that.

It only means that if you have been brought up in a particular concept, it is better to follow that - follow that! It has gone deep in your bones and blood, so it is better to follow that.

But now it has become impossible, and it will never be possible now again because the old patterns have broken. Now, no one can be a Christian, no one can be a Hindu. That is not possible now, so a new categorization is needed. Now I don't categorize as Hindu and Mohammedan and Christian.

That categorization is not possible now. It is just dead and must be thrown away. Now we must categorize every path.

For example, there are two basic divisions: the path of relaxation and the path of effort, the path of surrender and the path of will. This is a basic division. Then other divisions will follow, but these two are basic and quite diametrically opposite. The path of relaxation means surrender just here and now with no effort. If you can, you can. If you cannot, you cannot. If you can, you can. If you cannot, you CANNOT - there is no go. The path of surrender is very simple: Surrender! If you ask how, then you are not for this path, because the "how" belongs to the other path. Mm? "How" means by what effort, by what technique: "How am I to surrender?" If you ask, "How I am to surrender?" then you are not for the path of surrender. Then go to the other.

If you can just surrender without asking how, only then is it possible. So it seems simple, but it is very difficult, very arduous, because the "how" comes instantaneously. If I say "Surrender!" you have not even heard the word and the "how" comes up: "How?" - then you are not for this path. Then the other path is of will, effort, endeavour. Then every "how" is supplied - how to do it. Then there are many ways.

So surrender has only one way, and there are no branches. There cannot be. There cannot be different types of surrender. Surrender is simply surrender. There are no types. Types belong to techniques. There can be different techniques; but because there is no technique surrender remains the purest path, without any division.

Then the second: the path of will. It has many divisions. All the yogas, methods, belong to the second. The second says, "You cannot relax just now, so we will prepare you: a preparation is needed. So follow these methods, and a moment will come when you will drop." They look difficult - they are not! They look difficult because they say preparation, methods, years of training and discipline are necessary. So they look difficult, but they are not - because the more time is given to you, the more simplified the process becomes. And surrender is the most difficult process because no time is allowed. They say, "Just here and now." If you can, you can. If you cannot, you cannot.

Baso, a Zen monk, would say to whosoever would come, "Surrender!" If the person asks, "How?" he would say, "Go elsewhere!" His whole life he used only two statements continuously - never a third.

He would say, "Surrender!" If you would say, "How?" he would say, "Go somewhere else!" Sometimes some persons came who would not ask, "How?" and would surrender. But rare becomes the phenomenon! As our modern mind progresses, rare will be in what the difference is betweenurrender, because surrender means an innocence, a trusting mind, an absolute faith. It doesn't need effort; it needs faith. It doesn't ask for the method and the way and the bridge; it takes the jump. It doesn't ask for the steps - it doesn't ask anything.

But the other path is of effort, tension. And many methods are possible, because to do something there are many techniques. There are many techniques for how to create the ultimate tension so that you explode. But never follow both. You cannot follow! You can just go on thinking about both.

And don't confuse. Determine clearly, exactly, which is for you.

Can you trust? Are you ready without any "how" to take the jump? If not, then forget relaxation, then forget surrender, then even forget the very word - because you cannot understand it. Then effort - and this Upanishad is talking about effort: upward effort, a continuous arrowing of the mind towards the peak.