More dangerous than nuclear weapons

Question 1:

The American ambassador is perfectly right, but he is not aware that the danger of intelligence is impossible to prevent. All other dangers are very small. They are visible, they may look big, but the danger that he is talking about is concerned with two things: one, that I am extremely intelligent, and second, that I am an anarchist. Both together are far more dangerous than all their nuclear weapons.

You need not be worried about how America should be prevented from destroying my efforts. It is beyond any power to destroy my efforts. The more they try, the more strength they will give to my ideology. This has been so in the whole history of man. No truth has ever been defeated. It may take time, but its victory is absolutely certain. In fact they have already started accepting their defeat when the American ambassador says to the head of a foreign government that I am extremely intelligent, and anarchist, and I can easily change human minds.

In his statement he has accepted their defeat. Now it is only a question of realizing it. Conceptually they have accepted it. Their desperate effort to destroy me, my work, my people is very symbolic.

Unless they are immensely afraid, they would not make such an effort - their fear shows their defeat.

One point is clear, that they are unable to propose any alternative to my way of seeing things. The statement makes it absolutely clear that they are utterly helpless. It is not coming out of power, it is coming out of a certain hunch. Deep down they have accepted defeat.

It is strange that they have all kinds of intellectuals on their side, but none of their intellectuals have the guts to propose arguments against me. These desperate efforts simply show that they know they are empty and their exposure is imminent. And every day they are becoming more and more desperate.

Intelligence can be defeated, because it is part of the mind, but the ambassador does not know that what he is calling intelligence is something much more: it is awareness, which includes intelligence, but it is far superior to intelligence, far higher. Intelligence can be argued against, but if awareness is there you cannot argue against intelligence. This is not mere intellect, this is a vision of the truth.

It is not a question of me, it is a question of the truth being defeated - which is not in the nature of things.

And he is trying to make the head of the foreign government afraid by adding the word "anarchist."

Anarchist means "one who does not believe in any government, one who does not believe in any kind of discipline, who believes only in the individual and his freedom to act, to think, to express, to create." For the anarchist the society is a means in the service of the individual - not vice versa.

Using the word "anarchist" with me, is simply to create more fear... and then saying that I have the capacity to change the minds of men. In that small statement he has made everything clear about why America is so afraid: my capacity to change the minds of men. It includes that I may change men's minds towards anarchism, and it shows their acceptance that I have a certain intelligence which seems difficult for them to encounter.

But as far as I am concerned, I am not interested in changing the mind of man, I am interested in destroying the mind of man. Changing won't help; it will be only a reformation, not a revolution. It will be a touch here and there but the basic quality of the mind will remain there.

I am for no-mind. The American ambassador and the American president should understand it - perhaps they have never heard the word "no-mind."

My effort is to take people beyond mind.

Secondly, I am not "extremely intelligent" the way they see it. I have no concern with intellect.

Whatever I am saying and doing is not an intellectual approach, but an existential approach. That is why they are freaking out. It would not have been difficult for them if it was only intelligence. They could have found a thousand and one arguments about it, against it.

But it is something they are absolutely unacquainted with. It is meditativeness, of which they don't have even a vague idea what it is. This unknown creates the fear in them. At the most they can think it is extreme intelligence, but it is far away from intelligence. Intelligence itself cannot reach to the world of meditation.

They are also not right when they say I am an anarchist, because anarchists like Prince Kropotkin and others are beautiful people but their philosophy is naive. They want there to be no government, no police, no law. They are too naive, too simple, too innocent, too childlike. They don't understand man - that he is full of animality, barbarism, cruelty, violence, murder, rape.

If all order and discipline is removed the society will be in a chaos. Right now it is in a chaos, but the chaos is in a certain order. There is a certain system, a certain method, but with Prince Kropotkin and their colleagues the chaos will explode into a state that man has never seen.

I am an anarchist in a very different way. I don't say there should be no government. I always work from the roots, I never prune the leaves. I don't say there should be no discipline, I don't say there should be no courts and no law - that would be simply idiotic.

What I say is that the individual should drop the personality, be authentic, be honest; that the individual should drop ambitions, desires, and start rejoicing with whatsoever is available. He always goes on hankering for the moon; the earth is available but he cannot dance here, he will dance on the moon.

My effort is to make man so immensely blissful, peaceful, silent, meditative, that the need for government disappears, that the need for the politician disappears, that sooner or later the courts have to be closed because nobody comes there or they have to be changed into meditation centers, that jails become useless. I teach man to be expressive. In the jails are the people who were taught to be repressive and could not repress and went against society; and now society is taking revenge.

I teach you to be expressive and to accept all your nature with pride - it is your inheritance from nature. Living naturally without inhibition, things like rape will disappear. Living silently and meditatively, violence is not possible. Compassion will be just a natural phenomenon.

Governments, politicians, parliaments, assemblies, should become useless. If I meet Prince Kropotkin somewhere I think he will understand what I am saying. Anarchism cannot be imposed from above, it can only be grown through each individual, from below. And as individuality becomes stronger, integrated, all these things are bound to disappear.

It is just like somebody is against medicines, and he wants all medicines to be destroyed. The idea is not bad. In a really healthy society there should be no medicines, but he is starting from the wrong end. First the society has to be healthy, so that medicines become useless, physicians become useless, and health becomes such a natural thing that sickness becomes something that used to happen in the past; it is part of history. Then automatically medicines will disappear. Medical colleges will close, you need not close them.

I am a far more dangerous anarchist than Prince Kropotkin. I don't talk about it, I am preparing for it. Prince Kropotkin was only talking about it. But Prince Kropotkin could not create it, because he had no idea that the individual has to be completely changed. Only then can there be a society which does not need any order: everybody is so responsible that the policeman is not needed on the street; neither is God needed in heaven to punish anybody.

Strangely the politician and the priest will disappear together. They have a certain contract. The courts and the temples will disappear together, because the courts live on crime and the temples live on sin - and you have to understand what the difference is between the two.

A crime is a sin that has been caught.

And a sin is a crime that you managed - you befooled the whole system and nobody could catch you.

So for the criminal there is the court, the police, the law; and for the sinner there is the priest, the bishop, the pope, the God. They need hell as their jail, they need heaven as their reward. But they are together, and they both will disappear together.

The American ambassador should understand that I am far more dangerous than he thinks. And as far as your question is concerned, they cannot prevent anything. It is not something that I am saying, it is something that is the need of the times.

The time has come for me.

I may be alone but the times are with me.

They may have all the forces, but the times are not with them. They are digging their own graves; they are out of date. Their ideologies, their philosophies, their theologies are all out of date.

My challenge is open.

I am ready to argue against everything that their society stands upon; it is hypocrisy and nothing else.

They can kill me - that is possible. That is not difficult, very simple. But by killing me ultimately they will seal their defeat. They will kill me, and later on they will understand they have committed suicide with my death. That's why they are trying other ways to prevent me from reaching people, because killing has been tried in the past; it has not succeeded.

al-Hillaj Mansoor's message became engraved in the sky. There have been many Sufis, but nobody is remembered like Mansoor.

Jesus Christ would not have even been known if they had been a little patient and ignored him. But they were too impatient, and they killed him - and he was only thirty-three. Only three years he had been teaching. And he was not saying anything that was dangerous; he was simply repeating the old scriptures.

Just a few things he was adding which could have been easily ignored - that he is the only begotten son of God... So what! Let him be. I don't think it hurts anybody. If he likes it, enjoys it, without hurting anybody, leave him alone. If he thought that he is the last messiah, the one that you have been waiting for, you could have enjoyed. You could have looked all around the messiah, watched, "Great!

Looks like the last messiah." You could have joked; more than that was not needed. Seriousness was not needed at all, because he was not saying anything dangerous to the society, to the vested interests.

Just by ignoring a few things which were childish, he could have been used very easily in the service of the old society - and nobody would have ever heard his name. And there would have never been this calamity, Christianity.

But crucifying him changed the whole thing. Crucifying him made it clear that the whole Judaic tradition is afraid of the man. Killing him sealed in some way the poverty of the philosophy of the Jewish tradition. They could not argue with an ignorant, uneducated man, and they had great rabbis, intellectuals.

The crucifixion seems to be absolutely meaningless. Perhaps they thought to get rid of him quickly, but that getting rid of him quickly has created Christianity which goes on growing. Now just the Catholics have passed the seven hundred million mark.

I have always called Christianity, Crossianity, because the cross is really the source, not Jesus. And it is not strange that the cross has become the symbol of Christianity.

These people who want to prevent my ideas from reaching people cannot do the same as they did with Socrates or Christ or Mansoor. They are very much afraid, because that will become the final defeat of their whole past. And Jesus has talked about only a few things. I have talked about everything concerning man under the sky; in minute detail I have given you the whole map, how man can be completely changed into a superman.

Killing me is dangerous, so they are trying a different way: I should not be allowed to stay anywhere, so people cannot come in contact with me. In India they cannot deny me, just by my birthright. So in India they have to do it the other way: they will prevent anybody from outside India from reaching me. That was their condition.

That's why I left India. I had gone to India; I was thinking to settle there, but their conditions were two. One, that foreign sannyasins would not be allowed. Second, the foreign news media would not be allowed. And these were the directives from America, so that I can be isolated. Then nobody is blamed for my death - and isolation becomes almost like a death.

I left India, thinking there may be some country courageous enough, but there seems to be no country courageous enough. In fact there are not many countries in the world... that is my experience from going around the world. There are only two countries, America and the Soviet Union - and there are puppets which don't have any independence of their own.

The Soviet Union is not the place for me. They won't even allow my entry just for three weeks as a tourist. They are already, without any contact with me, persecuting my sannyasins in Soviet Russia.

In the Soviet Union there are hundreds of sannyasins, and they have been spreading my message by word of mouth. They are writing books by hand, or typing them and distributing them, reading them in basements. My books have been taken away by the KGB. They have found up to now only twenty sannyasins, but they are continuously harassing them to know about more people who are also involved. And in the Soviet press there are articles about me. They know nothing about me, but my sannyasins are even translating into Russian.

Wherever there is truth it cannot be prevented.

So I cannot think of the Soviet Union. And I have tried all the so-called free countries and found that they are all part of America; they are not free. A message just comes from America and immediately they have to follow it.

In the old days there used to be political dependents; countries were politically dependent. There were empires. All those empires have disappeared - but it is very significant to understand that they have not really disappeared; they have only changed their color. Now they are no longer political, they are economic.

Wherever we have been the American message reaches the government immediately, or even before I reach there: that if they give permanent residency to me in their country, their loans for the future, which are billions of dollars every year, will be immediately stopped. And they have billions of dollars of loans which were taken in the past which they can never return. They don't have any resources to return them with. "So either you return those loans or we are going to raise the rate of interest. And as far as the future is concerned, all your loans are stopped."

Now this is an economic empire. It will take some time for people to understand that nothing has changed. There are still empires, but they are now economic, not political. Only their structure has changed. And this is more dangerous because it is invisible. You cannot see it. You see England as completely free, you see Spain as completely free, you see Germany as completely free. They are not.

In England, a one night stay at the airport was denied me by the government - and it was my right.

I had the jet, and I had tickets also for a commercial flight, so they could not in any way make it a point that you are not traveling by first class... So we all had first-class tickets for a commercial flight, and a jet ready, and in the morning we would leave.

We could have left that very moment but the time of the pilots was finished; they could not fly any more. Twelve hours rest was absolutely needed by law. But the airport authorities were informed that I am a dangerous man and I should not be allowed to stay in the first-class lounge. Now even I cannot think what danger I could have been in a first-class lounge, just sleeping. It was already eleven o'clock in the night, and by the morning we would be gone. And from the lounge there is no way to enter into the city or into the country.

And the same England allowed Ronald Reagan to use it as a base to bombard poor Libya. And Libya was absolutely innocent. The bombs were dropped in the night in a residential area. But Libya is a small country.... This is economic empire.

Both things were done by American instruction. I am dangerous even for an overnight stay at the airport, and using England's land as a base for bombarding a poor country, criminally, is not a danger.

So their effort in India was to isolate me; in all other countries their effort was not to let me have permanent residency anywhere. But that does not mean that they can prevent what I am doing and saying and what I am going to say. I will find a way.

It is not a question of me, it is a question of truth finding its own way. If it has any merit, if it is a need for humanity, then all these ambassadors and all these presidents don't matter at all.

The truth will reach to the young people. The young people are going to change, and the change is going to be far bigger than they conceive. It is not just changing their mind, it is taking them beyond mind.

And certainly the world will be anarchist one day - not according to Prince Kropotkin, but according to me. I am working with individuals, and when the individuals are ready all kinds of controlling forces will fall down on their own accord.

I have just said to Jayesh that if land is difficult, don't be worried, the ocean is still ours. We can have an ocean liner, enough for two thousand people to live on, and we can move around the world, staying in different places for a few weeks or a few months, and people can come to the ocean liner.

We can have our meditations on it, we can have our discourses there. It will be, in fact, far better.

I always had that idea - just I will have to get a little adjusted because of the ocean and the seasickness. But this politics is so sick that I would prefer seasickness than the sickness that is prevailing over the earth.

We will find a way. We are determined to find a way.

Question 2:

Love is beautiful, but changing. It is beautiful but cannot be relied upon; today it is there, tomorrow it is gone. It is more juicy than trust, more natural than trust, but trust is a higher quality.

In the dictionaries trust is almost misrepresented: there it means trusting someone who is trustworthy. It is more objective - because the man is trustworthy, you trust him. It is not your quality; it is the quality of the other person upon which your trust depends. And because there are rarely trustworthy people around, millions of people have forgotten what trust is. There is no chance for it. A trustworthy person is needed, and there are no trustworthy persons anywhere.

Nobody trusts anybody; hence trust has become a dry word, unexperienced - just a word with no juice, with no taste.

When I use the word ?trust' it is totally different. I don't mean you trust somebody who is trustworthy; that is not trust. The man is trustworthy, so it is not a credit to you. When I say, "Trust," I say trust in spite of the man - whether he is trustworthy or not. In fact when he is not trustworthy, then trust; only then will you find for the first time something new arising in your consciousness. And then trust will become a very lighted phenomenon, far superior to love, because it needs nothing from the other.

In my university days I happened to be roommates with a student who was a kleptomaniac. He was not a thief, he was a kleptomaniac - he enjoyed stealing. It was not that the thing was valuable that he was stealing; it could be anything - just one shoe, which is useless. What could you do with it?

But stealing was just such a joy.... And I had to live with him in the same room!

So whenever I was missing anything, I would have to look in his suitcases and in his cupboard. I would find my thing, and I would find many other things which I did not need - so I left them there because they were safe. What was the point to take them back and give the boy trouble? He would again take them and unnecessary harassment... So I would take only the thing that I needed, and I would use it and put it back again in his cupboard.

Even my clothes... I might go to the bathroom and he would put on my coat and leave. I would come back, and it was very cold and my coat was gone. I would look in all his clothes to find his coat and use it - and then I would meet him in the university and he would look at me and say, "You are using my coat."

I said, "Yes, because I could not find my coat." I didn't look at the coat - that he is wearing my coat.

I said, "I didn't find my coat. Somebody has stolen it or something."

He said, "Maybe in these days nobody can be trusted."

He was an innocent person, because he could see that I see that he is wearing my coat, and still I am not saying anything. I would put his coat back in his cupboard, but he would not put my coat in my cupboard. That too would go in his cupboard. But there was no problem. Whenever I needed one, I would find that at least one of the two would be there.

Sometimes it was troublesome. Even bedsheets would disappear, pillows would disappear - and now you have to look in the night where the pillows have gone. But I had made it a point that if my pillows were gone I would use his pillows - because who else can take my pillows? He had them somewhere.

Finally he said one day, "You are strange."

I said, "That's true. I am a little strange, a little crazy."

He said, "I always thought you were a little crazy because you are the only person who doesn't object. I go on stealing things from you - and I have even seen that you take them back, and then put them back in my box. And you never object."

I said, "I trust you. You are a friend. You must be taking care of my things - seeing that they are lying here and there, you have arranged them in your box. And what is wrong in it? - whenever I need them, I can get them."

He said, "But everybody thinks that I am a thief."

I said, "I don't think so. You simply believe in communism."

He said, "Yes, that's right. I don't believe that anybody has possession of anything. Whoever gets it first, it is his. But this idea never happened to me, that I am a communist. My God! If my father comes to know that I am a communist, he will throw me out of his home."

I said, "Then the truth is that you are a kleptomaniac. You are not a communist, you simply enjoy stealing things. And there is no harm. But sometime you may get into trouble, because I have been looking in your cupboard and things go on accumulating. The space is getting filled up, and they are not my things, so you must be stealing from somewhere else."

He said, "As far as stealing is concerned, wherever I go my whole concern is how to get something - anything, a fountain pen, a teacup. Just with the big things I am a little afraid, because once I was carrying the chair of my teacher and I was caught."

I knew the case when he was caught carrying the chair of the teacher. I had had to save him. I said, "I remember it. Don't remind me, because I had to save you."

He asked, "How did you save me?"

I said, "I told the teacher, ?The chair was getting very loose, and he has taken it to the carpentry shop to fix it.' "

He said, "My God, that's why he never said anything. He said thank you when I came back. A few students caught me and said, ?Go back and put the chair back.' So I came and put the chair back, and the teacher said, ?Thank you very much. You are very careful.' I never understood why he thanked me because I was really carrying the chair to our room."

I said, "You don't see that the room is small. Already you have brought so many things, so many significant things."

Shoes, sandals, cups, kettles, anything that he could manage to get his hands on... and when nobody was looking, he would rush out.

I took him to the psychoanalyst in the university. He asked, "Why are you taking me there?"

I said, "You don't know? He has many good things."

He said, "Then it is okay. I am ready. How long does it take? Do I have to go every day?"

I said, "Twice a week."

He said, "That's not good. Can't I have more days? He has good things?"

I said, "You don't be worried. He has good things. And while he is engaged in psychoanalysis - and I have already made it clear to him that you are a kleptomaniac so you cannot do anything about it - you can manage."

And he started bringing things from the psychoanalyst. One day when he brought the analyst's couch, I said, "This is too much! Where are we going to keep it?"

He said, "We will find some way, but this is such a good couch, so restful. I can lie down on it, and you can analyze me. Or you can lie down on it, and I can analyze you."

"But," I asked, "where is the psychoanalyst?"

He said, "He had to go home suddenly. A phone call came that his wife is very sick, so I thought this is the chance. Small things I have moved already, just this couch has remained. Now the room is empty. I am going again to have another look before he comes back."

The psychoanalyst came to my room. He said, "Where is that boy? I tolerated everything, but this is too much! He has taken my couch, and without that I cannot even work."

I said, "You don't be worried, the couch is here."

He said, "I don't want to psychoanalyze this boy. He is beyond me. I am psychoanalyzing him, and he is putting his hand into my pocket - just in front of me! And I know that he is very innocent - just if a loose button is there, he will pull it off. It is of no use to him. Can you find all my things that he has brought here?"

I said, "You don't be worried. As promised, I have been collecting your things." I gave him all his things, even the couch.

When the boy came back he asked, "What happened? - the room seems to be empty."

I said, "Since you are here, it cannot remain empty long. You continue. The psychoanalyst came so I gave him his things."

He said, "That's very bad. That I don't like at all. With great difficulty I had managed to bring the couch, carrying the couch on my shoulders." The whole university had seen it, and everybody knew that this boy is stealing the couch. From chairs to couch - he had really progressed. We had to stop his going to the analytical sessions.

I said, "You simply do, only in this room, whatever you want to do. All my things are available because they are still here in this room - from this box to that box."

All my boxes were empty. Once my father came to see me and he saw that I didn't have any clothes; all my boxes were empty. He asked, "What happened? Where are your clothes?"

I said, "You don't be worried." I showed him the other line of boxes. They were overfull.

He asked, "What is the matter? I cannot believe that you allow this idiot to steal your things."

I said, "He does not do any harm. He simply enjoys, and it is an innocent... but I trust him."

My father said, "What do you mean by trust? This is trust?"

I said, "Yes, I trust him, because whenever I have asked, ?Shrikant, just for five minutes can you give me my fountain pen?' he will immediately give me not one, but six fountain pens. He will say, ?You can choose any you want. You can have all six if you want.'

"He is a very loving person. Sometimes when I need money I ask, ?Shrikant, a new book has come to the bookstall and I need thirty rupees to purchase it.' "

He says, "Don't be worried," and he will give me thirty rupees.

I ask, "From where did you get them?"

He says, "Don't be worried. That is none of your business. If the person catches me, it is my responsibility; you have nothing to do with it. I have simply loaned it to you. You purchase the book, and whenever you have the money you can give it to me. The things which I steal, I always collect"

- he used to think that he is a collector of things - "and whenever somebody catches hold of me I simply return the thing to him, saying, ?I have enjoyed enough, you can take it.' "

Living with him was a little difficult in the beginning. My milk would come and he would drink it. My breakfast would be there, and it would be finished before I came.

I would ask, "What happened to my breakfast, Shrikant?"

He would say, "On the breakfast there is nobody's name. It came, and I was feeling so hungry."

"But," I said, "you have already taken your breakfast."

He said, "That's true. I have taken my breakfast, but I was still feeling hungry. If you want, I can bring one, two, three - as many you want - because bearers are bringing breakfast to the other rooms in the hostel. And he would bring more, saying, ?You have forgotten our room completely.' "

He was very kind and very loving, but on that point... That kleptomania was there, but it never made me distrust him. He never lied. If he had stolen something, he would say yes; if he had not stolen something, he would say no. He was, in that way, a very honest person. That kleptomania was his disease, a mental disease.

When you trust somebody in spite of the person, then you will feel a totally different kind of energy than is described in your dictionaries and than is ordinarily used in the world; that is objective, the trustworthiness of the other person.

When I use the word ?trust', it is subjective. Whatever is done to you does not matter: you don't lose trust in the intrinsic value of the individual, his integrity. His action is irrelevant. There may be a thousand and one causes for his action, but you don't take his action into consideration. You think of the individual, not of his actions.

And then there is a trust which is a fully grown love, where there is no possibility of hate, where there is only compassion.

But beyond love and trust is also a space which is neither objective nor subjective, which is simply there. Once in a while sitting here you may fall into that space - and that is something which cannot be named.

There are many things in existence which cannot be named, and those are the real things. That which can be named is of a lower quality, of a lower stratum, than that unnamed silent space. It contains love, it contains trust, and plus. And the plus is so vast... but it only can come, you cannot drag it.

So if it is coming once in a while, enjoy it. All that you can do for it to come again is to enjoy it, relish it. Your enjoying it, your relishing it, is an invitation for it to come again. Slowly, slowly a friendship with this silence grows. It becomes possible that you can just close your eyes and, without doing anything, the silence can descend on you. Not even desiring it... It will be happening more and more if you always remember not to desire it, but only to invite it - and there is a great difference between desiring and inviting.

Desiring is aggressive. And this is so subtle a phenomenon that you cannot be aggressive to it, or you will destroy it.

Inviting is totally different. Inviting, you are saying: I am available, my doors are open, and whenever you please you will find me awake and alert and ready. Not that you have to say these words... this feeling of invitation is enough, and the space will go on growing, go on coming more and more. First it will be coming sitting here with me; then slowly it will start coming in other places. Soon it will not be related to any place at all.

You just sit silently and remember the inviting mood, and it comes down on you as a cloud of light showering flowers. Only in the East are there trees with that kind of flowers. One tree which is often placed near the temples is madhukamini. Madhukamini means "sweet night." It blossoms only in the night, and it blossoms with white flowers - very small flowers, but in thousands. The whole tree is full of flowers. You cannot see the leaves the flowers are so many, and the smell... the perfume of those flowers reaches far and wide. The whole neighborhood becomes full of it.

And in the morning before the sun rises, all those flowers start falling. That scene is worth seeing:

just like rain those flowers go on falling, making a thick carpet of flowers underneath, because the tree sheds all its flowers in one night. Then again after fifteen days it will blossom.

As you experience the unnamed spaces, you will feel flowers showering on you. And that space has a certain fragrance, a certain light, a certain joy. But never desire it; that becomes the barrier. If you desire it, you will miss it. If you invite it, it will come again and again; one day it can become part of you. It has to become part of you.