Chapter 21

[NOTE: This is a typed tape transcript and has not been edited or published, as of August 1992. It is for reference use only.]

Q: BHAGWAN, THERE SEEMS TO BE A RESURGENCE OF CONSERVATISM, NOT ONLY IN POLITICS BUT IN PEOPLE'S SEARCH FOR INNER- STRENGTH, FOR TRUTH, PEACE. GROUPS SUCH AS THE MORAL MAJORITY APPEAR TO BE GAINING GROUND, STRENGTHENING THEIR INFLUENCE. WHAT IS THE DRIVING FORCE BEHIND THIS RESURGENCE?

HOW DOES IT CONFLICT OR DIFFER FROM YOUR TEACHINGS?

A: It always happens, whenever society comes to a point of revolution, the conservative forces have resurgence; for the simple reason -- to prevent the revolution that is oncoming. It is a defence measure. But in fact, it is an acceptance of defeat.

Conservative forces either in politics or in religion remain silent when they are certain that nothing is going to overthrow them. But when they see the danger, they collect all their energies to prevent any rebellion, any change, any transformation; so it is a good sign. It is just like, at the time of death it happens always that the person simply becomes perfectly healthy. All diseases disappear.

It is the last effort of his life energy. He risks everything because death is so close.

Now he cannot be moderate. Before a candle dies, the flame of the candle burns the brightest. It is a natural phenomenon.

You are asking me, "Why it is happening?" It is happening because man is at the very door where either he has to die or to transform. You will see this resurgence all over the world. But this is a resurgence that certifies the victory of the revolution. The old society is at the point of death. Before dying it will make its last effort to survive. But a last effort is a last effort. It cannot survive.

And you are asking me how I see it in reference to my ideology. I rejoice, because I can see the death, and I can see the conservative forces resurging with great energy. To me, it is a rejoicing, a moment of celebration.

The new is going to happen very soon; the old is having its last breath.

Q: BHAGWAN, THERE ARE THE FEW THAT ARE VERY RICH, AND THOSE THAT ARE POOR; BUT IN THE MIDDLE SITS THE GREAT MAJORITY WHO ARE AVERAGE IN INCOME AND INTELLECT. DO THEY POSSESS THE CAPACITY TO UNDERSTAND YOUR TEACHINGS? OR MUST SOME MATERIAL SELF-SUFFICIENCY BE ATTAINED BEFORE ACCEPTANCE CAN BE ACHIEVED?

A: The basic question is not to achieve material sufficiency; because there have been even poor people who have attained to the ultimate. When I say that the poor cannot understand the highest flights of consciousness, I am simply talking about the rule, not about the exceptions.

Kabir was a poor man; so was Farid a poor man. And there have been others too who achieved to the ultimate. But they were not of average intellect; they had as superior an intelligence as any Albert Einstein, perhaps better.

So the real thing is, the average intellect is a barrier. The average intellect cannot understand me, for the simple reason because when you talk about the higher realms of being the average intellect is left far behind. It is inconceivable to it; so the question is not material sufficiency. Even if somebody has all the worldly riches with him, but has an average intelligence, all his possessions are not going to help as far as religious growth is concerned. Then too he needs a sharper intelligence, a keener insight; otherwise there are so many rich people in the world. But you don't see so many enlightened people. I have known richest people; but their riches are only of the world; not of consciousness. Their consciousness is poor.

I used to stay in a palace of a very rich man. He was thought to be the silver king of India because he has the hold of the whole market of silver; it was in his hands to bring the prices down or up. But he was a man of average intelligence. I asked him, "You have everything conceivable." He was the only man in the whole world who had a Rolls Royce made specially with solid gold. Even the engine was solid gold, nothing but gold was used.

I asked him, "You have beautiful palaces; you have everything that one can think of, but I feel sorry for you because you are not yet bored. You are still thinking of having more and more. That shows the average intelligence. A higher intelligence gets bored very soon, because it can see that you can have everything of the world, but still inside you remain empty. In fact, when you have all the things in contrast you see your emptiness more clearly. And you see that death is approaching, and you are still collecting seashells on the seashore. And death will snatch away everything from you, and you will be dying just like any beggar. There will not be any difference in your death and in the death of a beggar. And unless you can make a difference in the quality of your death, it indicates that you have not been able to make a qualitative difference in your life either. Death is only a conclusion; it concludes your whole life, and if you have to die like a beggar then I can say to you that you have lived like a beggar. You may have lived in the palaces; but that does not make any difference."

He said, "I have never thought about it. I am so busy, there is so much to do. In fact, I am surprised when I hear that somebody is bored."

I told him, "You should remember, buffaloes are never bored; donkeys are never bored; dogs are so busy without any business, they are never bored. Except human beings, no other entity, no other living being in existence experiences boredom; and all human beings also don't experience it. It is experienced only by the highest intelligent people. A Jean-Paul Sartre experiences boredom; a Jaspers experiences boredom; a Marcel experiences boredom.

That's where in this century French philosophy defeated the whole British domination over philosophy for centuries, the German domination over philosophy for centuries. One is surprised, what happened suddenly? Because you don't come across a single great philosopher in France in the past. Since Aristotle to Bertrand Russell you will find great Greek philosophers, great German thinkers, great British philosophers; but you will not find a single French name. But something changed suddenly. With Jean-Paul Sartre, French philosophy proved far higher. Bertrand Russell became a pigmy for the simple reason because Jean-Paul Sartre brought words like boredom, anguish, despair, meaninglessness for the first time into the world of philosophy. He proved to be the keenest intellect.

Bertrand Russell is not bored. He has written much, but it is all average. Jean- Paul Sartre has not written much, but whatever he has written is not average; each single statement has come out of tremendous agony of the soul. He sees that life has no meaning, that it is an accident, that there is no way to make any meaning out of it, that you can go on playing with things just to avoid boredom.

Otherwise you are going to commit suicide. Because there is nothing else to do. It is all repetition. The same thing you have been doing your whole life. And you will continue to do it till you die. And strange that even people don't want to die.

I knew one great dramatist. He was dying, he was seventy five, he had asked me to come immediately. I rushed to his house and I said, "What is the urgency?"

He said, "Urgency? I am dying. Try to save me."

I said, "But for what; because I have known you for twenty years. It is the same routine. You have lived for seventy five years, and you are still not bored? Be thankful that death has come and you need not commit suicide, that death is a deliverance. I don't see any point. What you will do?"

He was angry at me. He said, "I have asked you to do something, to meditate for me. I am dying, and you are talking strange things."

I said, "I am not going to meditate for your life; because what you will do tomorrow? You will repeat your yesterday. But you have done it, and what have you gained? You just tell me, can you do anything new? Are you capable of thinking anything new. In twenty years I have never seen. I have looked into your dramas -- it is the same story, it is the same triangle. Just the names are different; but it can be reduced to the same plot. And you think you have created one hundred dramas? They are all carbon copies of each other. And you are still not bored? That shows average intelligence. And religion begins when you start feeling bored with your ordinary life, with the mundane life; when you are fed up with it all."

Naturally the poor man will need a tremendously powerful intelligence to be fed up of things which he had not got; that needs great intelligence. But the average man, wherever he is, whether poor, whether middle class, whether rich, does not matter. His average intelligence cannot get fed up with the world. And religion begins with the boredom, with the anguish, with the meaninglessness of all that you have been doing, of all that you have been. It is radical transformation.

I am reminded of a beautiful story. A king used to go in the night around the capital to see that everything is alright or not; is there some dissatisfaction? In disguise, he will go on the horse. He was puzzled about one thing only. The whole city was sound asleep, just a mystic was always awake, sitting under his tree, immensely joyous, enjoying the silence that has descended over the capital, enjoying the coolness of the night, the beauty of the stars. The king started becoming interested in the man. He seemed to be a rare man. He had nothing and he was so joyous; his eyes were sparkling with some unknown bliss; his whole being was radiating a certain energy field. Even the king, passing by his tree, had felt a certain breeze of silence, of joy, of bliss, of peace.

One day he could not contain his temptation. He touched the feet of the mystic and asked him, "Would you accept my invitation. I would love you to be in my place." And naturally, just like the average mind, although he was inviting the mystic, deep down he was hoping that he will reject. An ascetic, one who has renounced the world, can not come to the palace. But that was unconscious.

But the mystic was really a great master. He said, "Okay, so I am ready. Should I come right now, or tomorrow morning. Because tomorrow is not certain."

The king was shocked. This is not expected of mystics. This is the working of the average mind. Because he has invited himself, now he cannot withdraw. But his respect for the mystic disappeared. They reached the palace; the king gave him his best chambers, he gave him his best clothes, and each thing he accepted the respect in his eyes was going down.

Next day they were eating together, the most delicious food the king has ordered for the guest. But deep down the king was thinking, "I have been cheated. This man was pretending. He befooled me, he exploited me, he managed to impress me." And the mystic was enjoying the delicious food, and it was hurting hard in the king's heart; this is not the way of a mystic. It is all against the expectations of the average mind. Luxury is not for the mystical people.

Everyday the respect was turning sour. Within six months he had almost come to a point of hatred. The mystic said to the king that "I think it is time you should ask me a question. Why you go on carrying things within you? You could have asked any time. And I think now the moment has come. The love has disappeared, the respect has disappeared, and I have been watching all these things going away; and now hatred, anger, frustration has entered in you. This is the time you should put it out. Be straightforward."

The king said, "Yes, there has been a question that has been haunting me since you have come into the palace. It has become more and more clear. The question is, I want to ask you now what is the difference between me and you? You are living in luxury, you are living in the palace, you are enjoying all the riches possible. Now what is the difference between me and you? Why I am still a worldly man and you are a mystic, a master? I don't see the difference."

The mystic laughed. He said, "It is a beautiful morning. Can we go for a walk?

And perhaps, walking, I may be able to answer the question." They went for a walk.

The king again and again said, "What about the question?"

And the mystic said, "Wait just a little more. A little patience."

Then they reached the river, the boundary of the king's kingdom. And the mystic said, "I am going, leaving your empire to you. Are you coming with me or not?"

The king said, "How I can come with you? I have a kingdom, and I have thousand and one problems to solve."

And the mystic said, "Have you received the answer? I am going because I don't have a kingdom, and I don't have any problems."

Suddenly the king saw the difference, felt deep remorse, fell into the feet of the mystic that, "Forgive me. I had been stupid, but please come back. Don't go away. Otherwise my whole life I will carry this wound that there was a great master so closely available, and I missed in my stupidity."

The mystic said, "I have no difficulty to come back, but the problem is the same thing will happen again. Your respect, your love that has arisen back will disappear. I have no problem, I can come back. It makes no difference to me whether I go ahead or I go back, but it makes much difference to you. And I would like to leave you in a state of love, respect, gratitude rather than in a state of hatred, frustration. It is not basically a question of what you have, the question is are you contented with it? And you have a very average mind. If you are discontented with it, then there is a possibility of growing into the world of religion; moving higher into consciousness; a tremendous discontent with the world, a tremendous discontent with yourself as you are, that needs intelligence."

What can I do? I can simply explain to you for the average mind the priests have created a bogus religion, which changes nothing in them. The whole world is full of Mohammedans, Hindus, Christians, Buddhists, Jews, but nothing has changed in them. The priests exist for the average mind, the poor mind. He gives you a substitute, not the real thing. He cannot give you the real thing. Nobody can give you the real thing.

It is your own discontent which can bring you to the brink of revolution.

So the question is, not whether you are poor, whether you are middle class or super-rich. Condensed into a simple maxim, the question is, whether you have intelligence enough to feel the frustration of the ordinary life. Once you start feeling the frustration of the ordinary life, you are bound to go into search for something else, something different, something qualitatively different. The average mind goes on into the world of quantity; you have a house, you want a better house; you have so much money, you want more money. This is the world of quantity.

The intelligent mind moves in a new direction, a new dimension of quality. It is not a question of more money, more houses, more prestige, more power. It is a question of deep understanding, of immense insight, of coming to terms with existence, of having a communion with the whole, so that you can start feeling an explosion of meaning, and music and poetry.

But for the change from quantity to quality, you need an intelligence so sharp as a sword. And that's my whole work here; to go on shining your sword, giving it more sharpness. Your average mind is created by your society, because it needs only average mind, because it needs clerks; it does not need the mystics. It needs school teachers, it needs station masters, it needs business men. For that, the average mind is the right mind. The mystic is dangerous. You cannot make a mystic a station master. You cannot make a mystic a clerk. The difficulty is that the mystic cannot deal with quantity.

(Tape side B) The story is about Nanak that his family was in great trouble. They were poor people, and they wanted him, now he was young, they wanted him to be employed somewhere; but wherever they managed to employ him, within a week or two he was sent back. Because the people said that this man is utterly useless.

Finally, the father went to the king and said his misery; he has been an old employee of the king and he has served him his whole life, he was retired. He said, "I am in great difficulty. This is my only son and you have retired me. Now we have to depend on his earnings, but wherever we find somehow some employment he is turned back."

The king said, "There is no problem. You have served me with such honesty and such loyalty, I will put him into some department and something that he can do, something very easy. You send your son." And he was put in the ration shop where his work was only to measure wheat, rice, and other food stuff for different regiments of the king; and just give it to the responsible person who had come.

The very first day the trouble started. He was weighing and he started putting things into the bag the regiment officer had brought. It was going good up to twelve; from one, two up to twelve everything went well. But at the point thirteen -- the Hindi word for thirteen is tera; it also means dying, yours. It also means thirteen, but it also means -- mera means mine, tera means dying; so when he came to tera he stopped. He went on fourteen, fifteen, but he went on saying "tera"; he forgot the first meaning, thirteen; he remembered only the second meaning, that everything is yours. So the number went on from thirteen, fourteen, fifteen, sixteen. But to him, it stopped at tera; and the officer looked at him, is he mad or something?

He reported to the king, that what kind of man you have chosen? He does not know more digits than thirteen. He stops at thirteen, and then goes on counting thirteen, thirteen, thirteen.

Now that officer is the world of quantity. He could not even think that tera also means dying; tera simply means 'thirteen'. Now, on that simple word, two separate paths. One of quantity, one of quality.

The king himself came to see what had happened. Tears were flowing from Nanak. He was in a ecstatic mood, continuously pouring to everybody who was coming; beggars started coming, other people from the streets saw that he is just not taking any note who is taking. He is simply giving and shouting "Tera."

The king looked at him. He was a man of certain understanding. He said, "He may be wrong for you all. But he is a man of rare quality. I will remove him from here, otherwise he will destroy my palace. But this man is worth not to be a servant, but to be a king." And the king touched his feet; and that was the day that he was recognized by others, when the king touched his feet.

A certain intelligence that can change you from any moment of life into the qualitative realm; and the average mind is not born average. It is kept average by your belief systems, by your religions, by your politicians, by your education. He is kept average.

The family appreciates the average child; not the very intelligent child. Because the very intelligent child is continuously a trouble, a problem. He raises questions which the parents cannot answer; and they feel embarrassed. The average child never raises any questions.

So there is no problem for gaining material satisfaction. If you remain average, you can have the whole world. Nothing will happen to you. But you can sharpen your mind. And the method is simple: just what has been done to you, do the opposite. They have told you to have faith; don't have faith. They have told you to believe; don't believe. Doubt. They have told you to be with the crowd. I say to you, be an individual. And you will drop your averageness. It is just forced on you.

Each child is born with tremendous potentiality. But nobody wants him to have that become actual. He is prevented early, because the society needs retarded people. Otherwise, who is going to be a soldier; who is going to be a policeman; who is going to be a priest? Who is going to be a Christian, or a Hindu, or a Mohammedan? Only retarded people are needed.

The vested interests are immensely afraid of intelligence. And that's why they are all against me. This is my crime. I am corrupting people, because I am taking away people from the crowd, and I am taking away their averageness, their retardedness. This they call corruption.

But this is not new. They poisoned Socrates for the same reason. The same was the crime against him in the court, that he corrupts the youth. That authentically sincere man was simply telling people how not to believe. How to gather courage to doubt, inquire, so that you can come to know the truth by yourself, because all borrowed truths are not truths, but lies.

Q: BHAGWAN, IS THE INCREASING INFLUENCE OF RELIGIOUSLY MOTIVATED PEOPLE ON GOVERNMENT DIRECTING POLICY? WHERE WILL THE INCREASING INFLUENCE OF RELIGION ON STATE, LEAD?

A: It will lead even to a worse kind of world than we have got. It is the influence of the religious leaders, religious doctrines, that has created the hell of the earth.

And now, it is certainly increasing.

The reason again has to be understood, is that the politicians are also afraid of the rebellious youth. The wings of the youth have to be cut. It cannot be allowed freedom. You can talk as much as you like about freedom, but don't act it. And to be on the safer side, it is better to cut your wings, so you can talk about freedom.

But you cannot open your wings and fly into the sky, and have a taste of freedom.

The politicians are worried, because the youth is slipping out of their hands. And the only way they can find is, to have the support of the religious establishments.

Together with political power and religious tradition, perhaps they hope they can prevent the changing consciousness of the new age. So they are in a conspiracy against the future of humanity; a conspiracy against the new man.

And both are afraid of the same thing, so naturally there is an affinity.

Religion can influence people, through parents, through education systems, through churches, from the very childhood. Politics comes later. Religion comes very early in your life. It makes the foundation of your life. And they both are together. Again I say, this is a good sign; because they can see that separately they cannot stand the upheaval that is going to come. They have to join hands.

Otherwise there is nothing common between politics and religion. The only thing common is the vested interest in keeping people retarded.

You are asking me what will be the influence, what will be the impact of it? It will be a calamity if they ever succeed. It will be an abortion of the new man.

And that is the only hope, because the old man is finished; it is just a dead corpse, that is somehow just dragging itself just out of old habit.

There is a story in India; a great warrior Ramasangha(*) was fighting the Mohammedans invaders, and he was a furious warrior. In the war, his head was cut. Naturally, when your head is cut you have to fall down, lie down dead. But Ramasangha was such a furious warrior, he forgot. He went on cutting people's heads without head. In fact, he created a havoc. The enemies started escaping.

They had never seen such a scene -- a man without head cutting people this way and that way.

Perhaps that story is not true. I don't think it is possible without a head. But, it has a symbolic meaning. Just out of old habits, the old man goes on dragging himself. He has died long before, but he has forgotten to lie down; he goes on continuing. Not only that, he is conspiring that the new man should not arise, for the simple reason because the new man will be so alive, that perhaps it may remind the old man that "You are dead; that it is time you should be in your grave." All your politicians and all your religious leaders should be in their graves. But for that the new man is needed to give them the idea that they have been dead long before. They have not seen the living being, with all its joy and dance and song and love.

It is good. Let them join -- let all the dead people of the world join together. They are not more powerful than a single living new man. It is a crowd of corpses.

And they are making their last effort. They will do everything nasty that they can do, because when it is a question of survival you forget all courtesies, mannerisms; you put them everything aside, your animal comes out.

So the coming days are going to be very decisive; whether the animal, the barbarious, who has been doing nothing but fighting, killing, burning alive people for centuries, is to remain our future too? Or we are going to have a new future, a clean slate, to write our history from the very scratch.

It is tremendously decisive and I don't see that the old order can win against the rising sun. It has to give way. That is the nature of things.

The old has to die for the young to live; they have to vacate the place, howsoever resistant they may be and however long they may have occupied it, it does not matter. When the new man knocks on the door, they have to vacate the place, and simply go into their graves, silently and gracefully. Otherwise we will have to force them. We don't want to do that.I am reminded again; an old man, a Jew, was dying. All his four sons had gathered. The man was lying there, just in front of them, on his bed, just the last moments. But the sons were puzzled. The first son said, "What we are going to do, to carry his body in the casket to the graveyard? I think he should have a Rolls Royce, a limousine. The old man always wanted a limousine, but could not manage because of his miserliness. At least let him have it now, although he will be dead, and it is going to be only one way journey; he will not come back again."

The second son said, "You are always wasting money. What does it matter to a dead man, whether it is Rolls Royce or an ordinary car? I don't agree; a dead man knows nothing, and anyway he is not accustomed with Rolls Royces. He could not manage his whole life, why we should waste our money when he is dead?"

The third boy said, "In fact, what is the need of a car? We can arrange just a truck from the municipal committee. A dead man cannot make any distinctions. It is free of charge."

Listening to all this, the old man managed somehow to sit in his bed, afraid that what the fourth is going to suggest. He said, "Wait, where are my shoes?

They were all shocked. They said, "What you are going to do with your shoes?"

He said, "I am still alive, I can walk to the graveyard. Gracefully, let me reach to the graveyard and don't waste anything, and don't do such an ugly thing calling a municipal corporation truck. And the fourth has not still spoken. Perhaps he may like to drag me just down the road? Just find out the shoes because I am finishing every moment. Let me die gracefully."

The only man has only one choice; either he dies gracefully or he will force the new man to drag him to the graveyard. No politicians and no religious leaders can save that is dead. No politicians, no religious leaders can prevent what existence wants to produce. It is going to come. Existence is far infinitely more powerful than all your tiny politicians and your stupid Popes and Ayatollah Khomeiniacs, and Shankaracharyas.

If existence has a desire to create a new humanity because the old has failed, then no matter what these people try to prevent it, they are not going to succeed.

Their very efforts show that deep down they know they are losing power. People are slipping out of their hands. So it is a desperate last effort. But absolutely meaningless and absurd.

(Tape side C; seems to be a gap) There were few more questions I had rejected. But I don't want the journalist to go with the idea that I rejected them because I don't have the answers. I rejected them because they were not worth answering. But not to give him the idea that I don't have the answers for them, I will answer shortly and quickly.

First, he had asked that from America to India, from India to Nepal, now what am I going to do? Now I am going to do a world tour. Because I don't believe in politician boundaries, and I conceive the whole earth as mine; and I have my people all around the world, many of whom I have not seen for years. And I would like to see all of them. So rather than calling all of them in one place, which will be impossible, because now there must be at least three to four million people, the only way is that I should move, go around the world, have a look at my people, give them a little more fire; because they will need fire to burn many things.

Second, he had asked that "Bhagwan, you live in luxury, your life style is luxurious. What about your sannyasins?" In the first place, I am the poorest man in the whole world because I don't possess anything. And whatever I use belongs to my sannyasins, not to me. They have simply borrowed it for a time being to be used by me. And what gives you the idea of luxury? Perhaps you see the diamonds on my cap, you see the diamonds on my watch. Don't be befooled.

They are not diamonds, they are absolutely proletarian authentic stones. Just my people have cut them in such a way that they can defeat diamonds; even my watch is made by my own people, and it is studded with stones, not with diamonds. It has no value as far as cost is concerned; otherwise it is invaluable because it is a gift of love.

If you want to know about my food you can ask Devaraj, my personal physician.

He does not allow me more than two thousand calories per day. Do you think it is luxury? He is sitting in the kitchen weighing everything -- it should not be more than two thousand calories in the whole day, twenty four hours. Two thousand calories are given to really sick people who are eating in the hospital.

Would you like to change places? I am ready. You can have my robes, but you will have to eat my food too. And it looks apparently that I am using a very costly robe. But it is all synthetic. In the long run, it is the cheapest material possible. If I am using cotton, I will be using ten robes in the same time. Just one robe will do. It is the cheapest and the most beautiful. And everything from my shoes to my head is made by my sannyasins.

And what do you consider my life style? How can you manage to think it is luxurious? I don't drink alcohol, I don't go to dances, I have not seen a movie, I simply come two times out of the house to see only my people. I don't read anything -- books, magazines, newspapers, radio, television. I am not a member of any luxurious club. My life style is very simple. Mostly I am asleep. I love sleeping; because to me sleep is synonymous to meditation and in sleep there are nobody who is a beggar, nobody who is an emperor. Sleep is very communist.

What has given you the idea that I am living luxuriously? And whatever way I am living, it is my people who want me to be as comfortable as possible. It is their love. I have not asked it.

As far as my sannyasins are concerned, I am their luxury. They are the richest people in the world because they have me. There is no group compared to them.

Catholics have that idiot pope.

There is not a single group of seekers in the whole world who has a mystic amongst them, as a friend, who is not creating any kind of slavery; who is trying to give them their individuality, their freedom, their original face. They are the richest people in the world. So never say again that my people are poor.

Third, you had asked that "Your sannyasins need you, although you insist for independence. Can your sannyasins exist without you?"

You have to understand three words. One is dependence, which has been the law down the ages. To destroy dependence I have to talk about independence.

But the reality is neither dependence nor independence. Independence is only an antidote for dependence. It is like you have a thorn in your feet, then you take another thorn to take it out. The second thorn is as much a thorn as the first. But it helps you to take out the first. That does not mean that you should start worshipping the second thorn. You have to throw them both.

Dependence has been the law through the ages. That is one thorn. I give you another thorn -- independence, so that you can destroy dependence. Then what is left is tremendously beautiful and unknown experience -- that is interdependence. The whole existence is interdependent. You cannot exist for a single moment absolutely independent. You are breathing. You are dependent on the air surrounding you. If oxygen is removed from the air you will die immediately, with all your independence in your pocket.

You are thirsty, you have to drink. You cannot say that I am an independent man; I cannot drink water; I will remain, I will exist without water. Life is interdependent. We are all joined together; we are not islands. We are a whole continent.

I teach independence just as an arbitrary device to destroy dependence, so that you can become available to a new phenomenon -- interdependence. We all need each other. The farthest star is also feeding you; the sun is far away. It takes for its rays to reach to you almost ten minutes. And for the light, ten minutes is a very long journey. To you ten minutes seems to be a very small fragment of time.

But not to the light. Because light travels one hundred eighty six thousand miles per second; multiplied by sixty, that will be one minute travel; multiplied by ten that will be ten minutes' distance. So many miles! But we live on it; our bodies are warm because of the sun. Otherwise you will simply go cold.

Scientists are worried that one day the sun is going to die, because it is for millions of years radiating heat. It does not have an inexhaustible source. Its source is limited. One day, suddenly, the fuse will go off. One night you will see the sunset, and there is not going to be any morning again. But you will not survive either to see, that there is no more any morning. You will all become cold turkeys.

Life is one, an organic unity. Yes, my people have a certain communion with me, the same way I have a certain communion with them. There is no question of dependence, no question of independence. It is a question of becoming one.

Your fourth and last question was, "What happened to you in America?" Now the story is so old, it seems older than Adam and Eve. So please forgive me! I don't deal in junk.

Okay.