Darshan 11 April 1977

[A new sannyasin asks: What is de-materialisation? Is it possible?]

Everything is possible, possibilities are infinite. Materialisation is possible and de-materialisation is possible. In fact it is happening all the time.

There was a time when the earth was not there, then it materialised. And there are stars which are disappearing, de-materialising. Now physicists say that when a star de-materialises it leaves an empty hole in its place, a black hole - just emptiness is left and the whole of the matter simply disappears.

So it has nothing to do with any occult, esoteric religion. It is a scientific fact that out of nothing matter arises and again one day when matter becomes very tired - and it is not a metaphor when I say 'when matter becomes tired'; it really becomes tired, tired of being - then it disappears into nothingness. Now it is a scientific fact. It has nothing to do with so-called miracle-creating people - it has nothing to do with that; it is a simple fact.

Matter has two states: one, the invisible state, and the other, the visible state. The invisible and the visible go on changing - when matter is tired of being visible, it becomes invisible; when it is fed-up with being invisible, it becomes visible.

So don't look at things through occult nonsense; be more scientific. And now science is on the verge of mysticism. What physicists are saying today was absolutely inconceivable just fifty years ago.

If the physicists of fifty years ago come back again on earth, they will not believe what nonsense these physicists are talking about. To say that matter disappears into nothingness and nothingness materialises again seems almost a mystical statement.

That's what buddha has said, that out of nothingness existence is born and then it again disperses into nothingness - nothingness is the very source.

But don't get interested too much in such questions. They are futile, they don't help you in any way.

Always remember to be very pragmatic, always remember to be very practical. Ask questions that are going to help you grow, to help you mature, to help you become more aware, more peaceful, more blissful.

Intellectual questions are just meaningless: you can go on playing such questions and answers and you will not arrive anywhere - it is a sort of intellectual gymnastics.

I am answering you just because I have a deep respect for everyone. If anybody asks anything, only out of respect do I answer, but if you listen to me don't ask such questions; they are not of any relevance.

The only relevant and important thing is how to attain to clarity so that you can see what is.

[As Osho initiates a new sannyasin, he says:]

Raise your hands and close your eyes and if something starts happening in the body, go with it.

Just feel yourself not as the body but as energy, as tremendous energy: energy arises and energy starts dancing and you dance with it. If your hands start moving, spinning patterns, allow; if the body sways, allow; if the head starts moving, allow. Simply go with it - don't resist and don't hold. That will give me a glimpse of where your energy is....

Come here. Good - but you are holding back the energy, mm? It can simply explode, and the experience will be of great significance. And it will explode. In the beginning everybody holds it back unconsciously - not that you are deliberately doing it. It is there just ready to dance, it can immediately overflood you; but we have been unconsciously trained to hold back, we have been trained to control.

Through subtle conditionings we have been taught never to go out of control in anything - in laughter, in crying, in love, in anger - never to go beyond the limit. There is a limit to everything and we have been allowed only up to the limit and then we have to hold back.

After a long conditioning it becomes almost automatic, like a thermostat. Mm? you go to a certain extent, then suddenly something goes in the unconscious. something clicks and you stop.

Here, I will teach you how to un-control, because only in un-control will you become free. And when the energy is moving spontaneously with no mind behind it to manipulate, to direct, to dictate, then there is tremendous bliss.

The trees are more blissful; they exist on a lower plane but are more blissful. And so are the animals; they exist on a lower plane but are more blissful. And the reason is that they don't know how to control.

Man can be more blissful than the trees and the flowers and the birds, but man has to avoid one trap, the trap of controlling himself.

Once you start controlling yourself you are in conflict. Then one part wants to explode, another part goes on keeping it down, and so you become divided. That is the basic root of all schizophrenia - you become split, you fight with yourself. To control oneself is to fight with oneself. To control oneself is to fight with oneself, and then energy is dissipated.

You have great possibility - it will happen. Just remain alert, don't cooperate with this control.

This will be your name: Swami Anand Chetan. Anand means bliss and chetan means conscious - conscious bliss. Man can have two types of bliss. One is unconscious, you have it in deep sleep. In the morning you can even recapture a little glimpse of it - you can look back and feel that something was happening which was very peaceful, rejuvenating, energising. Something happened in deep sleep and you feel the after effect even during the day. You have been somewhere, but in an unconscious state.

Sleep is unconscious samadhi - it is unconscious meditation, it is meditation allowed by nature. But people are losing even that. Even sleep has become too full of dreams, that means too full of the mind, too full of the conscious, too full of the rubbish that one gathers during the day or during a life.

People are dreaming for almost the whole night.

And even if they are not dreaming, the dreamless sleep is not very deep, it is very superficial. So thousands of people are more tired in the morning than they were when they went to sleep. This is absurd, but this is happening. Then tranquilisers are needed and sleeping pills and this and that - a thousand and one devices are created.

Now electro-sleep is being invented, so each night before going to sleep you can fix an electric instrument and it will vibrate your mind and give you sleep. But that sleep will not be the natural sleep that nature allows you. It will be forced - even sleep will be forced, even sleep will be manufactured by you. It cannot be of any real significance, it will not have any rejuvenating quality. At the most it will give you a rest, but it will not release new life.

So in sleep sometimes we feel blissful, or in alcohol or through drugs we sometimes feel blissful - these are unconscious ways of being blissful. In making love sometimes one feels blissful - that too is an unconscious, biological way to fall into silence. But these unconscious ways are not worth much and they are momentary: one pays too much of a price for them.

The whole of yoga is nothing but an effort to create bliss consciously - that can be done. That is the meaning of your name, 'anand chetan': bliss, conscious.

Much work has to be done; you will become conscious. The energy is there, it is unusually there; in that way you are fortunate. If you work, soon the flow will be coming. You can nope for much and the hope will be fulfilled.

[A visitor said that a sannyasin had told him 'Osho will fix you up.'... A part of me still doesn't want to be fixed up but I became aware of a helplessness; I couldn't do anything by myself.]

That's very good, that's a great beginning - to feel helpless. That means that the ego can be dropped. It can be dropped only when you feel utterly helpless, when your world is crumbling and

you see that everything is collapsing and that on your own there is no way. But that's a great moment in life: that moment of crisis is the moment of spiritual birth too.

It is painful because it is almost like dying. To feel helpless feels so humiliating, but that is the natural thing - man is helpless! Nothing is wrong in you. That is the very state of life: life is helpless.

If you start feeling that helplessness totally and you accept it rather than rejecting it... rather than thinking that it is something which has to be solved, you start thinking that it is how things are - it is not a problem to be solved, it is a mystery to be lived, this mystery of being helpless... then surrender comes naturally, surrender comes spontaneously. Surrender becomes the door to come out of it.

Mm? take a jump into sannyas.

You can wait, mm? You can wait, but it is going to happen. For me it has happened, I have given you sannyas; now it is for you to take it any day you feel like, mm? Good!

[A sannyasin had written to Osho saying he would like to ask his partner to marry him, in front of Osho.]

I have to do all sorts of things: marriages, divorces. Very good! Just remember one thing: never become serious about it. Take it very very playfully. Marriage becomes poisoned the moment you take it seriously.

The moment you start taking the other for granted you are already in trouble; then sooner or later you will be on the rocks. Never take the other for granted; that is very insulting! To take the other for granted means that the other has become a means, is no more an end. If the other's freedom remains intact, the marriage is beautiful. Never interfere with the other's freedom.

The mind is very political - it wants to dominate. So marriage becomes a game of domination: who dominates whom, and how. And the whole time, for twenty-four hours, husbands and wives are trying to find new ways to dominate. Naturally, beauty is crushed, love is crushed and killed, and the whole thing that started as a beautiful experience becomes ugly.

Never take the other for granted and never interfere with the freedom of the other. And the way to do it is not to become dependent on the other, because to become dependent is a subtle way to dominate.

... don't become dependent, remain happy on your own. Your happiness should not be dependent on [her] and [her] happiness should not be dependent on you. You should be independently happy and sometimes sharing your happiness. But it should not be the case that you cannot be happy alone.

If you cannot be happy alone you will start taking revenge, because then she becomes dominating.

She is needed for you to be happy, so your happiness is no more a free experience - it is a sort of prison. And we can never forgive a person who becomes very essential to us; it is impossible to forgive that person.

So you remain happy on your own, she remains happy on her own. Remain individuals, that's what I mean. Ordinarily the wife does not like the husband to be happy on his own and the husband does not want the wife to be happy on her own. If the husband sees the wife happy on her own, he feels hurt. So she can be happy on her own? - that means he is rejected or he is not needed. The wife cannot see the husband smiling with anybody else, laughing, talking, enjoying.

The wife cannot even tolerate the husband watching TV and being happy; she becomes jealous of the TV. If the husband is reading the newspaper and is feeling very happy and at ease, she will come and throw away the newspaper, will take the newspaper. The newspaper becomes a competitor: 'I am here and you are reading a newspaper! How do you dare!' This makes things ugly.

And if the husband can be happy only with you, he cannot be happy. If you can be happy only with the husband, you cannot be happy, you cannot be very happy. It is so absurd: it is as if the husband demands that when he is not at home you should not breathe, when he comes home you can breathe - you must always breathe with him. Your life is together, so you should not breathe alone. And the wife thinks that when you go to the office you should stop breathing. When you come home you can breathe as much as you want, but nowhere else!

That's what is happening with love - you cannot be loving anywhere else, you cannot be joyful anywhere else. So if the husband cannot be joyful anywhere else, how out of the blue can he be joyful with you? Then to be miserable becomes his habit. For twenty-three hours he is miserable and for one hour the wife allows him to be happy - so he pretends, and deep down he remains miserable.

My idea of marriage is that two persons who are happy on their own join together to share their happiness - but they remain independent, they remain individuals. Then there is never any need of divorce. The so-called marriage creates the divorce.

Divorce will disappear only when this so-called marriage disappears - when marriage is not a legal bondage, when marriage is just a decision taken out of happiness, out of love and for the moment!

There is no promise for the future, that tomorrow you will remain married.

The moment you promise for tomorrow you have already sacrificed even today, and then you will become afraid about tomorrow - what is going to happen?

If love remains, good; if it disappears, good. And the god of love is very whimsical: it comes when it comes, it goes when it goes. You cannot order it to come now - you cannot put it on and off like that. When it is there it is there. It is like a breeze: suddenly it is there and suddenly it is gone. So never promise.

This marriage is not a promise for the future; it is just a commitment to this moment. Obviously the next moment will be born out of this moment, and if this moment has really been of value to you, the next moment you will be together - even more together than this moment. If this moment has been of great happiness, the next moment is going to be of even more happiness because it will grow out of it. It does not come out of the blue, it grows out of this moment. But people promise for tomorrow because they are afraid. Their life is not a growing life, hence the promise.

All promises are false, and an authentic person will never promise anything - because how can one promise? One is so helpless; who knows about tomorrow? You may die! She may die! She may fall in love with somebody else - she is an alive person, mm?

So just no promises, mm? Good!

[The Encounter group is present. One member said he had a pattern, in everything he did, of only going so far and then cutting off.]

It is a pattern of almost ninety-nine percent of people, it is a script every child is prepared for - only to go to a certain extent and not beyond. So everybody more or less is in this trap. A difference is there, but that is only of quantity, not of quality - of degrees.

You must have had a very disciplined childhood, the parents must have been disciplinarians. They must have been good people, hence the harm. Good people are dangerous! They are too good and they also try to make the children too good. It is out of their love, but all that comes out of love is not necessarily good.

They wanted it for you, but they can do only that which they know; whatsoever their parents have done to them they have done to you. Now you have to go through a process of deconditioning.

So I will suggest that the tantra group will be very good, mm? because basically somewhere the fear is of sex - as I can see it right now. Mm? all other things are just expressions of it.

The whole humanity has lived very sex-centredly, so everything hangs there. If you can achieve a total orgasm things will immediately change. If you can go into the sex experience deeply, then you will be able to go deeply anywhere else - the depth of your sex experience will decide the depth of all of your experiences.

If one cannot go deeply into the sexual experience then one can never go deeper into anything else, because that is the most fundamental experience and the most natural experience. Your biology is ready for it, you are not expected to learn anything about it.

For example, if you learn music it is not in-built, you have to learn it. Sex is built in. If you learn poetry or painting or dancing, you have to learn it. Sex is just there - the script is already given in your biology, it is not a mind thing.

So if you cannot go deeply into sex - which is such a natural thing - how can you go deeply into music and how can you go deeply into dancing? If you hold yourself back in sex, you will hold yourself back in dance too. You will not be able to go into any relationship either, because everywhere the relationship tends to become sexual. People are so afraid....

In the West, people have become so afraid even to hold the hand of a friend because somebody may think that you are gay or something! - you are holding the hand of a man! Or if you hug a man, you will look all around: is somebody looking or not? Otherwise they will think you are queer or something. Just a simple expression of love, and people have become afraid.

If you relate to a woman you are afraid - because sooner or later, if you go deep enough in the relationship, the sex problem is going to arise. So you go only so far. You say hello and good-bye and there it ends. Then, by and by, one becomes afraid. And the modern mind particularly becomes afraid, because so many things have become known and the knowledge has not helped you to go deep, it has helped to make you afraid.

Now a man is afraid to make love because he worries about whether he will be able to make it or not. Never before in humanity's history was man afraid, but after Masters and Johnson every man is afraid of whether he is going to make it or not, whether he will be man enough. The woman is afraid - is she frigid? The woman is afraid of whether she will be able to have the orgasm or not. If she cannot have an orgasm, it is better not to go into sex at all because then it is very humiliating, or she has to pretend.

And the man is so afraid and nervous and trembling inside about whether he will be able to prove to the woman that he is the greatest man in the world. What nonsense! Just being yourself is enough - you need not be the greatest man in the world. But that fear cripples you, paralyses you.

So almost ninety percent of males suffer from premature ejaculation because of the fear, the trembling. Then it becomes a self-defeating process: once you fail or you don't feel that you have really succeeded, then the fear settles in, then you auto-hypnotise yourself more and more. Then one day you start living out of fear instead of out of love.

So my suggestion is that you do Tantra, mm? And after Tantra do Hypnotherapy, these two; And then remind me again. Things will change - nothing to be worried about,, mm? Good!